Hound sharks and Cat sharks

[MrJaws]

Hi,

I seldom fish (the wife hates it) but I am looking to start a breeding in captivity programme/study with smooth hounds and cat sharks.
I live in London so nowhere near the ocean (unfortunately) but will be searching for local premises for a fairly large saltwater set-up.

I require some assistance in that I need a few live egg casings of the cat shark, small male and female specimens of the smooth hound shark and when the set up is complete, two pairs of mature male and female hound sharks.
I would be willing to pay for specimens and could discuss temporary holding tanks and delivery/collection.

If there is anyone who regularly comes across these two species around Brighton and is interested in assisting me, please do get in touch.

Kind Regards

Bryn

[lazy hooker]

i don't know if this is a joke...i presume it is.

to even consider keeping smooth hounds you would need to be very very experienced in keeping fish.

firstly is it ethically right to take a fish out of the wild to keep in an aquarium...especially smoothhound which travel vast distances.

2ndly how big do you plan on your aquarium being....i would suggest you would need at least 10000 gallons....smoothhound mature at about 90cm so your going to have a couple of fish nearly or at the 1 meter size......as an idea this is a 2500 gallon pond....so 4 times larger!!!!



what sort of filtration will you need....it will cost thousands!!!!

also how are you going to keep the water cool????

do you know anything about the reproduction of smooth hounds???

how are you going to facilitate water changes of approx 2000 gallons on a weekly basis????

How are you going to ensure a stress free environment for them to breed??? its not just a case of lobbing them together and hey presto!!

[scottish_and_mental]

more importantly why would you want to captivley breed 'cat sharks' ( dogfish to the rest of the planet ) when the seas are teeming with them . they have no commercial value as a food or as a sport fish - infact apart from us shore anglers they have no value at all
ive fished over20 years and only ever seen a couple of 'mermaids purses' washed up on the shore so finding a live egg sack is gonna require either a diver or an adult pair first.
i think perhaps you are serious either that or the coffee not kicked in and im still asleep from last night session where incidently i had 2 dogfish and a number of male and female rays ..

[MrJaws]

Hi Lazyhooker,

This is not a joke. Did you know that smooth houndsharks are on the threatened list of species due to constantly being caught as bycatch & flake etc?

You would not need to be experienced - you would just need to know what you are doing - there is a difference - One does not need to be experienced to know what one is doing and how to go about it. I have studied sharks for years.
There are many things in this world that are not ethical, we could sit and debate this until the world ends. I did not post the message for a debate.

I could answer all your questions but what point does it serve, you are not the one doing it. I asked for assistance, not a debate. If you can't assist me or comment positively then stop wasting my time.

B.

[tjnorton]

Turning this into a debate.

1. You would need to keep the water at the correct salinity.
2. Water temp would need to be chilled of in a tank.
3. Also all chemicals would need to be right I.E. Hydrogen, sodium, chlorine, strontium, phosphate, iodine, barium, copper, fluorine and magnanese all to name a few.
4. Lighting the tank. Correct light spectrum
5. Filtration

knowledge yes! experience yes!

People are only concerned about the fishes welfare. Don't snap at them just explain the conditions of the pool or tank.

tj

[MrJaws]

Hi TJ,

I am snapping at them because I did not like the "Tone" of their reply.
I have the assistance of someone who has succesfully bred sharks in captivity where my knowledge is lacking. I do not have the set up yet and was merely asking who might be willing to assist me with a few specimens when I have the correct set-up. Your reply is more in keeping with offering assistance which is really what would have been preffered to Lazy Hooker.

Thanks!

B.

[MrJaws]

To Scottish & Mental,

Acctually the seas are not teeming with them as they used to be. The shark is acctually Near Threatened or on the IUCN Red List. Bycatch all around the world is bringing their numbers down drastically and I would like to help conserve them by returning some to the ocean - Also they are pretty good eating from what I have heard.

B.

[scottish_and_mental]

Originally Posted by MrJaws

To Scottish & Mental,

Acctually the seas are not teeming with them as they used to be. The shark is acctually Near Threatened or on the IUCN Red List. Bycatch all around the world is bringing their numbers down drastically and I would like to help conserve them by returning some to the ocean - Also they are pretty good eating from what I have heard.

B.

Well, as you are on a site with mainly U.K anglers asking for specimens of fish found in U.K waters to be delivered to a U.K address i will assume that the species you are reffering to are the Lesser spotted dogfish ( common as muck and not endangered ) and the common smoothound ( mustelus mustelus ) plus perhaps the starry smoothound .
If however you mean the true catshark that is from the pacific regoin then i'm not sure how were supposed to get one to Brighton
Both common and starry smoothounds are netted in vast numbers of the west sussex coast and are not consumed in th U.K. - most infact end up as pot bait .. good eating ? show me one place that sells smoothound
The 'good eating you refer to is the greater spotted dogfish or Bullhuss - sold in the chippy as 'rock' .. odddly its never been a popular choice
If your plan is to breed dogfish and return them to the U.K waters ( i'm not sure what you mean by ocean - we dont have one close enough ,other than the atlantic ) then i think you are a few sandwiches short of a picnic ..
I suggest you go back to your shark expert and tell him to explain exactly what species you should be protecting.
Anyone can give you as many 'specimens' of these species as you like ... doesn't that tell you something ?
I won't open this to debate like my good friend , instead i will just point out actual facts - something that seems to be lacking from this thread
Im a great lover of sharks - help protect the basking,porbeagle,thresher,blue and other native species and i'll be over the moon

[lazy hooker]

right then...seeing as i was only asking how you intended to keep these, and in what conditions...

you have made some answers on here which show you as not being in fully aware of whaterever you are trying to do!!!

You would not need to be experienced - you would just need to know what you are doing - there is a difference - One does not need to be experienced to know what one is doing and how to go about it.

great founding for a breeding project that intends to release fish back into the wild ....by you saying that you do not not needing experience....i take it you have NO experience...just intend following some instructions!!! ha

you've studied sharks for years.....then you would know that "mermaids purses" are "dropped" off shore....lack of knowledge i think!!!!!!

I could answer all your questions but what point does it serve

think it would actually give people a bit of confidence that your not speaking out your arse!!!

Breeding program to breed and release the endangered dogfish...give me a break....even your ICUN red list says this about them!!!

This is one of the most abundant elasmobranchs in the Northeast Atlantic and Mediterranean Sea. Although localized depletions appear to have occurred in some areas (e.g., in the Wadden Sea and off Malta), scientific surveys throughout the majority of its range suggest that populations are stable or even increasing in some areas.

so why the breeding program again

then lets get onto smooth hound.

red list says about common

They are a relatively important sport fish in some areas, such as the Bristol and English Channels. Species-specific landings data are not available and no other information is currently available to determine the status of this species in the region. As such the species is assessed as Data Deficient in the Northeast Atlantic.

and what it says about stary

Mustelus asterias is more common than M. mustelus in the Northeast Atlantic. Within UK waters, it seems to be most abundant in large bays, outer parts of large estuaries and in coastal areas, including the Outer Thames, Solent, Bristol Channel and Cardigan Bay (Ellis et al. 2005a). Fishery-independent surveys suggest stable trends in catch per unit effort (Ellis et al. 2005b), though the numbers caught are generally quite low in these surveys. Though it has a continuous distribution, there are certain areas where it is locally abundant, including potential nursery grounds in outer estuaries and large bays.

and this is what the UK SHARK TRUST says

The Common Smoothhound is a widespread although not
abundant species. It is taken as bycatch in trawl and gillnet fisheries
but there does not appear to be any immediate threat from
overexploitation in the Atlantic

seems you may have interpreted the threat to these three fish incorrectly.....good job you've been studying sharks for years!!!!


so lets see
you don't know how to keep the fish!!!
you have no shark breeding experience.!!!
your asking for purses that you really should know won't be found on beaches!!!
You don't even know that the species your refering too are not endangered!!!

jog on!!...and may be time to stop licking those halucinagenic frogs from the next lab!!!! cos you do come across as a crack pot who has no idea what he's on about, of either the subject, how to breed them, and how to keep them!!!! ha ha ha

[pingu]

sorry guys shutting this thread gone way off topic and personal