Leadcore, is it dangerous

[mikergj]

Originally Posted by Simon N

I Can See That In Certain Circumstances Some People Will Use It. I Personally Wont Ever Use It. Its Banned Within The Club Im With Because People Dont Know How To Use It Correctly. Ive Seen Leadcore Being Used With A Swivel On Each End Of The Leadcore. Im Still Convinced That Any Peice Of Tackle Is Dangerious In The Hands Of Anyone That Doesnt Know How To Use It Correctly.

I dont understand why something is banned because people dont know how to use it, should that person not be banned for not educating them selves in the safe use of a product. I have come across the above pictures and could some one tell me or confirm to me if the same set up was used with out the lead core, ie. exactly the same but with a differant leader material that this picture would not exist.

If you had a gun licence and used your gun in a dangerous manner, ie. endangered life, would you not have YOUR license taken from you.

I am still in two minds if I shall use this product, but at the moment I am coming up with the fact that the product is not the problem it is the numptys using it.

[peakoverload]

Originally Posted by mikergj

I dont understand why something is banned because people dont know how to use it, should that person not be banned for not educating them selves in the safe use of a product. I have come across the above pictures and could some one tell me or confirm to me if the same set up was used with out the lead core, ie. exactly the same but with a differant leader material that this picture would not exist.

If you had a gun licence and used your gun in a dangerous manner, ie. endangered life, would you not have YOUR license taken from you.

I am still in two minds if I shall use this product, but at the moment I am coming up with the fact that the product is not the problem it is the numptys using it.

Come on mate you can't seriously compare gun law to a rig used to catch fish! A gun has one purpose and one purpose only and that is to fire a projectile, what that projectile is aimed at is an entirely different matter but the very fact that there is absolutely no control over the projectile after it leaves the barrel makes it inherently dangerous regardless of whose firing it or what they are aiming at. At the moment in order to get a firearm license you have to apply to the police and pass a background check and state why you want one, where your firearm will be stored etc etc. There are however no such restrictions over air rifles and pistols and pretty much anyone can buy one and is the reason why thousands of wild birds and mammals are killed and/or taken to vets because some twat thought it would be fun to shoot them for no other reason than their 'entertainment'.

The same applies to fishing. Anyone can get a license, no checks are made, no test of your fishing skills, knowledge is set so a complete numpty can pick up a rod and go fishing.

Take that back to your gun analogy, you wouldn't give something capable of causing death to someone who wasn't qualified and trained to use it hence why a firearm license requires stringent monitoring and vetting but with fishing tackle we seem quite happy to do so. There are therefore only three options open to us all:

1. That you have to pass some kind of test in order to get a fishing license.
Never going to happen and would require annual retesting anyway

2. Do nothing and allow fish and other wildlife to die needlessly and in pain and distress just so we can enjoy ourselves.

3. Ban or at least seriously reduce the use of rigs and materials that carry a high potential risk of death or injury to fish and wildlife and especially to those that also require a specialist knowledge in order to use anyway.

Leadcore isn't deliberately dangerous but it has the potential to be so and often by accident it therefore, IMO, has no place in our sport, especially when there are much safer alternatives that are just as effective.

[Bungz]

Just a flip side are we talking all leaders here should be banned? As its the knot not the material in the leader which is the danger.

I have fished pits with bars so abrasive you would leave a hook in a carp every run without a leader for example.

[chazyboi]

Problem is with most tackle i find when looking at peoples rigs is the strength of the rigs alot of the time they are over gunned for the fish in the pool,,hauling a pasty to the bank on 15to 18 lb line is a joke then not playing it out and haveing it flap about on the bank not angling at al,l i blame the so called big guys ( lol )and tackle companies for force feeding us the way to do it properly when in fact its just to make money,, as Maddison said alot of the time slack line and simple end rigs will kill on waters where the scientific rigs wont ,,i taught my little girl this way 13 and she has pleanty of 20 plus lb fish under her belt at 13 ,,,,i have seen alot of changes in carping in 35 odd years from technique to rods to handling care some good some bad ,,,the bad fixed rigs ,bad handling no mats sacking ect and leadcore and kids not being taught the correct way ,,i have seen first hand this stuff being used in the hands of novices who are told its the way to go and it has 9 out of ten times looked deadly ,,on a lake i fish i showed the owner two 20lb carp i had caught the mouths were ripped apart and they were lacerated up the flanks , he banned it and right he was fish that size arnt cheap and belong to him not us its our duty of care as fishermen to look after his carp and any other fisheries carp
On a carp web site im a member of this discusion on lead core was brought up, a poster put forward some scientific experiments his work had carried out on leadcore they found fish hooked on lead core do not heal as quick i cant rem if it was down to the lead or the way it rubs on the fish i will find the link ,,but the findings were it was not healthy for the fish the only person for lead core on that post could not put forward a safe leadcore rig says it all as he was known carper ,also if it breaks and kinks it becomes a serious tether risk cutting the fish to bits ie the pictures i also have one of a swan ,
in conclusion 30 odd years plenty of big fish to mid 30 on variouse style waters i have never used it and will never use it ,if you want to nail your line use putty saves all the weak nots and it looks better in the water ,,,common sence is the key to good safe angling

[chazyboi]

miker its banned because of what it does not because of bad use ,, even a seasoned carper can loose and tether fish no one is perfect

[mikergj]

I have tried to stir up some debate here as a new carp angler. And at present I am definitely leaning towards ditching the stuff. As I said , I did make a couple of rigs up and the lead came of both quite easily. As Bungz mentioned any leader could be deadly if tied incorrectly.

Also as you mention peakoverload, you cant really compare a carp rig to guns and there laws. I was just trying to get across that it is not the gun that is dangerous but the person holding it. If that is the case with lead core then I dont see why I should not use it.I have researched and learnt how to tie the stuff properly and dont put myself in the class of a numpty.

How ever , if I can find evidence that a fish trailing lead core compared to any other material or product we can use is in more danger of harm then I will definitely bin the stuff as I am already leaning that way at present.

So far, thankyou for all your comments and input on this subject. Just one more thing that I notice in the carping world. Would a lesser breaking strain hook lenth than your leader and main line not solve this problem of leaving the fish towing all this around.

[Woodsman]

This is the first time I've heard of using leadcore for carp rigs.
Over here in the Great Lakes we use leadcore all the time & I've never heard of any problems with it.
Here it is used for trolling to get your lure deeper in the water column. Using up to 10 colours (300') is common. 10 colours trolled at 2.5 mph will get you down aprox. 40'. Type of lure will effect depth as will boat speed & line test strength of the leadcore. Usually the heavier line test of the leadcore the less deep it goes as the leadcore is the same just the covering varies in thickness & strength. Higher strength leadcores usually have higher resistance to the water when being trolled which equals less depth.
When leadcore is trolled it sways through the water sort of snake like increasing the action on the lure.
When ran off planner boards (gets your line further off to the side of the boat for fish that shy away from the boat) leadcore can be very effective.

[chazyboi]

@mikergj yes i always use a lighter hook link to main line makes sense ive seem 15lb merlin to 12 lb line before dont get it myself you could have w weak spot in your line 20 ft from the rig not good to leave trailing in a carp ,for ease of change i use a rig clip so i can slide my hooklinks on easy then sraight to swivel and saftey rig for eg 10 or 12 lb merlin to 15lb berkley big game 3lb tc chub power weaves (best rod chub made )as i fish on a big water with heavy fish that run like trains into snags i dont use inlines as i can change the lead to suit ,,on smaller water 8 hook link 10 lb main 2lb tc rods,,lighter the line better the distance cast you will get aswell but do not forget the margins for carp had some big fish under the tip,, experiment but like i said previouse quote maddison ""rig tube and slack line" will deffo catch fish uncomplicated and easy

[chazyboi]

@ woodsman your fishing in a different situation and a different style in a snaggy english lake the stuff is lethal for a tethered carp we use it took keep our line hard on the bottom of the lake as not to spook over fished for carp